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| bitsy correction: not 60 Years On, it was Border Song | |
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pidunk 02:36 am UTC 06/05/07 |
| In reply to: | re: I’ve been meaning to write and post this for a while now but just haven’t got round to it. Wemb ... - pidunk 02:33 am UTC 06/05/07 |
> > > > > Sure in my own selfish way I was pissed at him for doing > > Bat 3 the way he did you see this was my legacy as well. > > > This music has been my life for nearly 30 years now how > > could he not consider what the implications of doing a Bat > > Album with out Jim would mean to people like me. Ok I’m > > being a tad melodramatic but you get the point. > > wenners, I know you are not thrilled so far in your > thoughts of me, but I would like to reply with my thoughts > of your post with relatings to my own history of being a > fan, without any particular biases. We seem to be around > the same age so in the sense that you later relate your > perspective, I understand what you mean. > > When you say that it is your legacy, what you seem to mean > is that anthematically, these songs even ignorant of the > writer, for example, have been the seal of your life's > pivotal points, and as such, you relate to them as > extensions of yourself. As a fan, not ignorant of either > the writer or the performer, you have a greater > sophistication as a fan, than one who assumes that the > performer is the equinox of all that is the performance. > You know that it is not. You know that the songs come from > Jim Steinman, and as an appreciator of the songs, and not > the performance per se, you pay your homage for the > meaning to your life's pivotal points, to the writer, and > appropriately so. > > When you talk to someone about Bat Out Of Hell, you want > them to know what you mean, and what it means to you, > without the dilution by the encroachment of other forces > in B&A^T3. You don't want to have to qualify your > statements, explain your statements, or apologize for the > fact that you are misunderstood if interpreted into > meaning that you place B%A#T3 into the same category, if > someone should misunderstand you. You want it to be > simple. You want to say it simple. You want your statement > to be understood. You are partly angry because now, you > are, by other people, forced into a position of personal > compromise. That is not selfish. > > Jim told Meat Loaf and mentioned such on his blog that his > opinion of calling the album B*$AT#3 would be insulting to > the audience. Understandably, you feel that insult. > > > > > >but I also wouldn’t want to miss it if he did. > > I would wager the bet that you really would not. You are > angry, sure, with good justification, but for all the past > and all the good, you would not. Not only that, but > history and humanity have a way of winning out in the end. > > > > > > > > Oh sure before you say it > > there are other old farts out there singing still, The > > Stones, The Who, Elton John, Bowie, to name a few. Now I > > haven’t seen all of them live but you can’t tell me that > > they sing high octane songs each 30 minutes long. Ok > > slight exaggeration but you get the point. > > Fans who are not sophisticated do not look behind the > artist to see what is behind. In the case of Elton John, > there are thousands who say, Bernie who, regarding the > lyrics, and John did also write with the lyrics of Tim > Rice, similarly as did ALW. Elton John as a performer, > performs the music he wrote, but did not write any but one > verse (by his own statements) of his own lyrics, (that > verse being one verse of "60 Years On", on the > Tumbleweed Connection album). It was easy for me in > the early era to be a devout fan of Elton John....we are > talking about never missing an area concert, buying albums > on release date, wearing tee shirts, having posters and > articles on the wall, and knowing every detail published > about the man and the work. But the last detail I became > savvy to, was that he did not write the lyrics. I wasn't > assuming that he would not and I was not looking for > anything like that. So many fans of Meat Loaf are that way > concerning where the songs came from. That is why so many > money monsters are able to talk Meat into the viability of > doing projects without Jim. That is why Meat ever got the > idea in his head that there could be this strange hybrid > of a project called B(A&T@3. That is why so many people > accept it. But Meat knows, the vocal majority knows better > because the Steinman fans are louder than everything else. > > > Another example of fan ignorance comes in regard to the > early works of David Bowie, where he is lauded to so much > extent for the amazing work that is Ziggy Stardust and The > Spiders Of Mars. Those songs, the way that they are > arranged, is the work of Bowie's then guitarist, Mick > Ronson. Mick spun off from Bowie later and made a > stupendous album called Slaughter On Tenth Avenue > which proved this point. After that, it was no mystery why > and how the style of Bowie's works had changed. Mick is no > longer with us, but one could realize he also had known > Jim, when they see that Mick worked with Ellen Foley in > 1979, and Sparks in 1976. Jim is a friend of the Mael > brothers, whom also had been produced by Rundgren. Of > course you would already know this. > > The issue of fan sophistication is one that comes up from > time to time, when being a fan who is both sophisticated > and inquisitive into the works that are loved. It is > understandable that you want the integrity of your work as > a fan to remain intact. > > > > > > > > > Then I started to think where and who can I go to see that > > is going to sing 10 or more Steinman songs. There is no > > one. So in the worse case scenario I would be able to sing > > at the top of my voice some great if not most of the > > greatest Steinman tunes not having to worry about the > > neighbours thinking an animal was dying. > > > Absolutely. If B#A6T@3 is functional as an excuse for this > privilege to come about, why not appreciate it for that? > There is nothing quite so special as having the chance to > let loose with something so close to your heart without > having others think you are strange. > > > > > > So the show started I concentrated and with my untrained > > musical ear I was determine to pick up on any lip-syncing > > but I couldn’t tell. > > What I have observed about lip synching on concert stages > came from the experience of having attended 74 concerts of > various assorted amazing and not so amazing artists in the > course of a two year period between 1973 and 1976. > > I attended shows at New York Academy of Music, Carnegie > Hall, Madison Square Garden, Nassau Coliseum, Felt Forum, > Avery Fisher Hall, Brooklyn Academy of Music, The Bitter > End, The Bottom Line (they opened around 1975, and I saw > some shows there), and the first concert I ever attended > was to see Seals and Crofts at the auditorium of Madison > High School in Brooklyn, in 1970. The first major concert > I attended (S&C were still so obscure that the high school > show was not sold out and it was before their radio > airplays) was in 1971 at Madison Square Garden when I saw > Rod Stewart with Faces. The last major concert I attended > was Elton John double billing with Quarterflash at Irvine > Meadows in California, in 1982. The last semi-major > concert was through won tickets to see Peter Paul and Mary > at The Greek Theatre in Los Angeles in 1983 or so. It got > for me, to be a boring experience, to be able to > anticipate whether or not there would be an encore, or > whether or not there was a tape backup to the performance. > Ho hum. > > Encore: you know there is going to be an encore if the > band keeps the amplifier lights lit on the equipment on > stage. I imagined what it would be like if everyone knew > like me, and didn't applaud...would they force the change, > and compel the band NOT to have an encore? I did not > bother using the energy for an outcome that I knew would > take place. Let the other audience members spend their > energy. The Moody Blues had a policy not to play encores. > They did not keep the amplifiers lit on the stage. People > cheered and cheered and wasted their collective breaths, > and I knew, the show was over. The only time I did not > know what was going to transpire was when John Lennon made > his famous appearance with Elton John in 1976, and > neither, it seemed, did the other members of the audience. > > > So, on that night, a new phenomenon took place, which came > to be taken for granted as others decided to carry the > behavior to other shows. For the first time I ever saw in > concerts, people got out of their chairs and lit matches > and lighters to ovate the performance and beg for an > encore of John Lennon with Elton John, and this was done > for such a sustained period of time, that the air got > thick inside the 20,000 seat arena, and it was hard for > me, way up in the last row of the place in a section > dubbed "heaven", to breathe. Just when I thought I might > pass out, I heard the ceiling fans begin to roar, of the > MSG's ventilation air conditioning system. The air > cleared, the guys took back the stage, and an amazing > history was made. Whatever gets you through the night. > > Lip synching has been referred to me as a tape backup. I > knew when there was a tape backup when it was not part of > the instrumentation on the stage. Clearly in the absence > of a visible Moog, there would not be possible a Moog > segment without a tape backup. With voice, there would > also be such. To know lip synching from a tape backup, I > think I might look at the level of perfection of a vocal, > combined with the motion of the body....too much motion > makes a perfect vocal impossible. But Meat has a history > of moving much to his vocals.....you could also look at > the distance between the mouth and the microphone. You can > look at when he takes his breaths onstage and where the > phrasings are on the vocal. Whether you could actually > perceive these things is probably much different than > knowing what you might like to perceive, to know the > difference. > > > > > > Now on a second note unless my memory and powers of > > concentration or even a mental block of some sorts the > > only non Steinman song that was sung was Blind as a bat > > apart from the intro to the second half when the band sung > > Alive. (Someone correct me if I’m wrong) Now personally > > maybe im reading to much into this but I kind of take that > > as an admission that he feels the non Steinman songs just > > aren’t up to it as it s a bit quick to drop the song > > that’s the title of the current album. This is just my > > humble opinion. > > > > But maybe just maybe he actually realises what a mistake > > it was to do this album without Jim? > > > > I think that there is much going into his new stance, and > I do not think it has to do with regret as much as > realization, like you said. Meat has realized that he has > caused many people to have to explain what they mean when > they refer to their personal anthems of Bat Out Of Hell > works, and it is like getting one's hand caught in the > cookie jar. One could be embarrassed. > > | |
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